Yes, I’m Going There: Do You Spank Your Kids?
If you’re wondering, based on the title of this post: No, no I do not. To be 100% honest, there was one time I gave my older boy something a little bit more than a tiny tap. I did not hurt him, but I know I scared him. And worse: I scared myself. I didn’t get over it for weeks. I still can make myself cry thinking of that moment, a moment I assure you my son has long forgotten.
I bring up the spanking issue because it remains a topic of interest and debate. I’m not always certain why. There are many things that can legitimately be debated in the parenting world — like co-sleeping or not, or homeschooling or not. But spanking? Hitting kids does nothing, I believe, to change behavior, unless you’re trying to create violent kids who hit their dolls, dogs, and siblings. And maybe later their own children.
I bring it up today because I got this message, last week, from a reader of my book. Her first name is Lauren, and though I answered her privately, she agreed to let me put her question out there to all of you. She’s looking for advice. And so am I. Can we talk?
Here’s what Lauren wrote me. Emphasis in bold type is mine:
In your book you keep saying to do things the way that best suits me, and I love that. My only issue is that, I don’t quite know how to feel about spankings. My mother dealt out spankings (I was an only child) when she got very frustrated (with me, my dad, her parents, the Dalai Lama, etc). They were completely erratic. One day I could have burned the house down and it would have been just fine, the next I could have walked across the room wrong and suffered her wrath. Her “spankings” usually escalated to what I felt was abusive. They usually had very little to do with me. I’m in fear (yeah, I said it, even after reading your book) that because this is the way I learned. I’ve been through counseling, but I can’t help but feel like my mother is living inside me somewhere, just waiting to emerge. I have no problem with spanking as long as it’s for a reason. But I am hoping for maybe some suggestions that don’t involve it. My kids are 3 and 4 and time out seems to be a joke. I never took it seriously either as a child. No discipline method I have tried has offered long lasting results (not even the spankings). I’m frustrated to say the least but I’m trying to keep my cool so that the cycle of abuse doesn’t continue. Again, not looking for a fix-all, just some suggestions and methods that you yourself have implemented.
I wrote back to Lauren that my best strategy for poor behavior is remain dead calm, repeat that this not appropriate or acceptable behavior, and then walk away from it. I said that negative attention is as much a tantrum-feeder as positive attention would be. I say this is my strategy, but I don’t use it so much as I wish I used it. I don’t. I yell and get frustrated and then I walk away. I try to stay calm and consistent, and “try” is the best all of us can do, amirite?
Time outs never worked for my kids, either; I think that’s a personality thing. Frankly I think it’s the parents who need the time out, and I take them.
But I kind of feel my advice to Lauren only scratched the surface. What would you tell her?
July 29, 2013 @ 1:16 pm
Thanks for your post Denise. Here is a recent short clip from my television show where I handle this exact problem, and I offer alternatives to spanking: http://youtu.be/OMjsmg4w1RI
July 29, 2013 @ 3:17 pm
Nice segment. Thanks for sharing! I’m a recovering spanker. My biggest struggles with parenthood have been self-care & consistency. Being around an otherwise-lovely family of origin is tricky since I’m trying to parent less reactively. Invariably, someone feels the need to jump in and “nip it in the bud,” when I’m really just trying to breathe before I react. Sigh.
July 29, 2013 @ 1:35 pm
Well, I don’t claim to have anything to add since I am not speaking from experience yet, but simply my own exploration and preparation as a mother of a 21-month-old. I don’t agree with spanking and hope I never snap, but I know it happens. I’ve certainly yelled out of frustration and then felt very guilty since I’m dealing with a child who is primarily dealing with a lot of frustration out of his own inability to communicate and our inability to understand what he wants. When they are tiny babies, they cry because they need food, sleep or a diaper change. Now, he may be crying/screaming because he wants the chair I’m sitting in on the other side of the room, or because someone closed the bathroom door. Hard to communicate this with a five-word vocabulary. and, seriously, why does he care whether the door is closed????
Anyway, I recently started reading a couple of books that question the usefulness of timeouts very effectively and have kind of turned my whole worldview upside down. The books are, How to Talk So Your Kids Will Listen and Listen So Your Kids Will Talk, and Duct-Tape Parenting.
I haven’t figured out how to apply their lessons to a young toddler yet, but am trying to take the long view. The first says that time outs don’t teach your child anything about how to correct their behavior and gives the example of four-year-old hitting a younger sister. What the kid needs is for someone to teach him/her about how to cope with the frustration/anger of a younger sibling touching with his/her stuff without hitting, but instead he/she is sitting in a corner feeling resentful and plotting revenge. The second is about letting your child experience the natural consequences of bad behavior rather than artificially creating them through timeouts/grounding/taking away privileges.
I don’t know that I’ll be able to live up to the examples of parenting recommended by these two books, but it’s what I’m striving for.
July 29, 2013 @ 1:40 pm
Thanks, Catherine! I LOVE Duct-Tape Parenting; I’ve talked to the author Vicki Hoefle a couple of times. Here’s a link to an interview I did with her, here:
http://deniseschipani.com/shut-your-mouth-mom-vicki-hoefle/
Denise
July 29, 2013 @ 2:39 pm
Thanks. Come to think of it, I bet I heard of Vicki Hoefle on your blog! I love her book.
July 29, 2013 @ 2:42 pm
A friend of mine pointed me to this post, by MomDocKathleen, and what I really really like about it is that she — a pediatrician who has, sadly, treated kids severely hurt by parental abuse — actually started out as a parent thinking a swat here and there was okay, but reconsidered. She has some good suggestions, it’s worth a read:
http://childrensmd.org/browse-by-age-group/toddler-pre-school/to-spank-or-not-to-spank/
July 29, 2013 @ 3:00 pm
Well what has helped me the most as a parent was teaching ten years of middle school before becoming one! Lol!
But seriously, I spent at least 45 min a day with at least 20 kids between 10 and 15 years old. Not once did I ever spank them or resort to physical violence, bc that’s not allowed. I rarely gave detentions or sent them to the office, and my kids learned and were respectful to me and each other. That has filtered into my parenting. I’m smarter than a kid. I can come up with a logical and age appropriate consequence for any action. I can keep my cool. I can look at their actions and see them for what they are: the actions of someone who needs more training.
I also realized how to create preventative measures and procedure! Now it may seem like something that doesn’t apply at home, but it definitely does. Many problems that come up are of our own creating. It’s past nap time, we weren’t respectful, we didn’t give them the amount of time appropriate for their age, etc. Many of them are also bc we haven’t finished training our kids (or we haven’t started). This is an ongoing process. Telling someone something once does not mean they’ll remember. Telling a kid once, is pretty much a guarantee they won’t remember. But having a set procedure for something and letting them know gives them the power they need to accomplish something and the power you need to back it up.
For example, my 2 year old recently learned how to open doors. As soon as she opened the front door for the first time, I closed it and told her she had to ask before opening that door. So she knows the procedure for that door. Now if she opens it bc she forgets to ask, as I’m sure she will do, I don’t have to get upset. I just remind her and close the door. It takes so much of the emotion out of our response.
In class I had a couple pages of procedure. I’ve never written our home ones out, but they’d probably be the same. I implemented a new one today, don’t take anything off the kitchen counter without asking. She did great…until she forget ten min later and took her plate and proceeded to drip syrup all over the floor.
I did raise my voice when I said her name and had her move, but the logic side kicked in (again 10 years of middle schoolers has definitely helped develop that skill). And I calmly cleaned it up while she stayed back and reminded her of the rule.
That’s it. Life happens. Kids do not have common sense, they haven’t been around long enough. They’re going to constantly do stupid things for years, and if we can’t get a hold on our emotions we’re setting a very bad example of how to react to difficulties.
By the way, I think it’s a good thing to sit down and think of things that might help prevent problems (boys are wrestling, rule is if one’s hurt, you both stop so hurt one doesn’t attack the other out of anger). And think of logical consequences to things that happen often (arguing with sibling, sounds like a lesson in cooperation is needed, have them wash windows together, one on each side( but remember to see if you’re at fault too–left them alone too long, one’s tired, etc); toddler says no to clean up, tell them you are going to take it away if they don’t clean up, then do so, for five min or a day whatever you think is appropriate (but I’ve found if I’ve offered to help, mine is much better at cleaning something, even if I end up only picking up one or two things.). Or they throw themselves on the ground bc their angry or frustrated, pick them up, tell them that’s not the best way to deal with those emotions and help them get through them (and again look at your own actions to make sure you aren’t causing frustration and anger needlessly.)
We are smarter than them. We can think of something that works that doesn’t involve spanking. If nothing else, tell them to go sit in your room (or wherever the most boring room is, just to give yourself a break to cool off and time to think of something logical as a consequence.)
The last bit I think is big is that we have age appropriate expectations. These differ from kid to kid, but generally most two year olds aren’t going to sit quietly for an hour at a restaurant with nothing to do. And most 8 year olds aren’t going to remember everything they’re supposed to bring to their softball practice. And most 14 year olds aren’t going to be all that aware of how many texts their sending. UNLESS we’ve set them up to succeed: toys and books at the restaurant, a checklist on the door before going, having the 14 year old review every bill and prepare the payment and giving him/her tips on what to do if their texting has reached the limit.
It’s all about thinking ahead, establishing some kind of procedure and reacting to the situations calmly and if possible with a sense of humor. That’s really what creates a disciplined person: someone who can see that thinking before doing is important, that doing things the right way is better than the consequences of doing them the wrong way and that when things go wrong we can rationally and calmly deal with them. If my daughter gets to that point by the time she’s an adult, I’ll be happy.
July 29, 2013 @ 4:10 pm
Kelly,
thank you so much for this long and comprehensive reply! It’s wonderful that you can apply your years of teaching experience to your parenting. Middle school teachers have a tough job! (Says the mom sending her firstborn to middle school next month – gah!)
Denise
August 4, 2013 @ 11:03 pm
Thank you!
July 29, 2013 @ 3:36 pm
I also recommend the book Soft Spoken Parenting. Really good read. Here’s a really simple review I did on it. http://www.thegiveway.com/2013/06/22/soft-spoken-parenting/
July 29, 2013 @ 3:52 pm
My husband and I occasionally spanked our daughter, who is now 10. We didn’t “snap” or do it out of anger. She always got a warning that she would be spanked. We never lost control and were always calm (we aren’t ones to lose our tempers at all about anything.) We would give her 1 or 2 swats with our hand, on the bottom. We didn’t have to even do it hard (not that we would) because it hurt her feelings so badly that she cried. We only had to give a spare few because she learned so quickly. She is one of the most empathetic people I know. Even her teachers every year go on to me about her kindness. She has never hit a person or an animal. She doesn’t hit her stuffies or dolls. She has even verbalized, without being prompted, that she understands why she got the occasional pop and explains her view to me. My husband and I were also spanked (a lot) as children and are both gentle people who have never been violent. We don’t even have guns or anything like that. The association of violence with spanking seems silly to me. Most of my adult friends were spanked as children and none are violent in any way.
July 29, 2013 @ 4:09 pm
Thanks for your perspective, Kimberly. I was thinking along similar lines — I was spanked, but in the way you describe, and not very often AT ALL. It was more the idea that you’d get the swat than anything else. I still don’t think it’s a good thing to do, because it’s VERY hard to control it the way you do, among many other reasons. But what I was thinking is that have been swatted — me and my husband — didn’t turn us into violent people.
July 29, 2013 @ 7:25 pm
I feel you. I don’t like the idea looking back. As easy as she has been, I think we could have done with out it. I do have an ex- friend though who spanks her son and it does nothing for his behavior. I’ve seen her do things to him that are close to child abuse. She does it out of rage. Her husband doesn’t like it at all. I ended our friendship over quite a few things I didn’t like. But the treatment of her child was one of them (I did talk to her about it.)
July 30, 2013 @ 1:47 am
I’ve read that the effectiveness of spanking, as well as the potential psychological effects has to do with the culture the kid is in. If that’s what every parent does, it’s accepted. If its only what their parent does, it can lead to problems. I think that might be why a lot if us who were spanked back in the day, don’t see it as an issue, bc it was something a lot of other kids dealt with.
I know a six year old who gets spanked once in awhile and in a calm manner. He once lied to me, and I admonished him and said, “it’s not like I’d beat you.” In which he replied, “my mom does.” Which I know is not true (we’re very close with all of them). And she was there and scoffed and rolled her eyes at his drama. But in my head I thought, I would never have equated my mom spanking me to beating. So I wonder how much of this is not necessarily a spanking or not spanking issue, but instead a shift in cultural expectations of child rearing.
July 29, 2013 @ 5:19 pm
I have always believed that time outs just give your kids time to plot their next move.
But it works for us because one of my daughters has a temper and the other has processing issues, so the talking helps both of them really understand why you can’t always behave the way you want to, or do whatever you want in the house or at school.
I don’t spank, but I do yell (more of a bark to get their attention — KNOCK IT OFF!)
My twin daughters are still very spirited and like to test every single rule with which they’ve been presented. One of them has finally figured out that good things happen when you follow the family rules, but the other one still gets a lot of time in her room with me, discussing behavior and how to help her deal with her negative emotions.
My discipline strategy has always been to remove us both from the situation and to sit there together while the emotional part passes and then we talk about it. SOmetimes this can take an hour, and BOTH of my daughters have suggested I just spank them and get it over with sooner.
There has been HUGE improvements in behavior, but we still have issues and I still do the same thing. I have found that when I’m doling out a consequence it helps to have a list because both my daughters can get me angry enough that I will take away playdates forever just because that’s the worse thing I can think of — and of course it’s unrealistic.
I remind myself that it’s a kid’s job to test boundaries and some kids are better than others at figuring out what those boundaries are. My kids always seem to be better at the testing part.
Interestingly, though, I don’t spank them, yet they hit each other (used to be me, too, but they have stopped doing that) all the time (it’s one of the few behaviors that I still see frequently). I was spanked, yet I am a very gentle person, so I’m not sure if that is passed along or not. I do know that it would send a confusing (if not downright silly) message to my children to hit them to get them to stop hitting each other.
July 29, 2013 @ 5:21 pm
Forgot to mention that my daughters are now 10, going into the 5th grade.
July 29, 2013 @ 5:49 pm
I’m a big fan of whatever disciplinary/correction/instruction method works for whatever child. Some kids respond well to time outs, for example, but would never respond to a spanking – and vice versa. In a perfect world, we would all parent as Kelly mentions in her comment (loved that!) but let’s be real, here: it’s not a perfect world and we are not all perfect parents. I try to reserve spankings for important, serious offenses…like dashing away from me in a parking lot after he’s been expressly told to hold my hand. But no matter when I spank him, he always tells me “Mommy NO hit me!” So spankings aren’t the best choice for my son. It’s a struggle to find out the best way to get through to him sometimes, and I think all parents deal with that struggle.
July 30, 2013 @ 1:57 am
I totally agree! That’s why I kept mentioning my years as a teacher. I’ve literally have been trained for the last 10 years by 100’s of 10-15 year olds on how to deal with them without resorting to physical violence. I imagine I would, as a parent, have a lot more struggles if I hadn’t. I mean, my first year of teaching I threw an eraser across the room! The hardest part, I think, as a parent is there’s no stand still time like I had. I had years to work on my patience, negotiating skills and “quick think of a consequence” kind of mind. With one kid, who is changing every day, there’s no time to figure it out bc you’re in the midst of it all (and sleep deprived…). It is definitely tougher to be a mom than teaching middle schoolers.
July 29, 2013 @ 9:42 pm
My child is quite a challenge and this has helped us:
http://www.cooperationcounts.com/
August 1, 2013 @ 3:09 pm
Time outs ARE partly for me. Because I do have a temper and the timeout allows me time to get my emotions under control. They have been effective for my son, almost nine, for the same reason. A little bit of space helps him reconsider what he was having a fit for in the first place, OR removes him from a situation that has gotten physical, like when he had a disagreement with his sister last week and whacked her pretty hard.
I don’t spank because I do have a temper. I have wanted to many times, but didn’t want to go there. My husband spanked our son once, lightly, and because it didn’t hurt, he laughed and wasn’t effective. The hubs opulent bring himself to make it hurt.
I was spanked as a child, and have no ill will towards my parents. My husband was spanked and said he always felt like his dad should have been above that. Yes, maybe sometimes he deserved the spanning, but adults should act like adults. If its not okay to hit another child, why is it ok for a parent to hit a child?
That mismatch in expectations led me to write this post, three years ago, comparing puppy training to spanking and children.
http://greatwallsofbaltimore.blogspot.com/2010/04/children-as-dogs.html?q=Children+and+puppies
August 2, 2013 @ 12:57 pm
Denise,
I’m in the same boat. My older son is heading off to middle school too. Deep breath!
I once overheard this exchange after a little kid wacked his brother. “Say you’re sorry. Right now! I’m not kidding. Say you’re sorry right NOW or you’re gonna get a smack!” New Yawk accent and all.
Good grief. Good luck in therapy years from now kid.
Best,
Alice
August 6, 2013 @ 1:29 pm
I have to say I did not read the comments so I don’t know if this was suggested yet. But while timeouts for my children work, what works better is time outs for their toys. If they can’t share it, the toy gets put on the shelf, usually for the rest of the day. Bikes, cars, blocks, trains, movies, anything can be taken away as punishment. I feel like loosing a priviledge is much worse than having to sit in the corner for a short amount of time.
Michelle <
August 6, 2013 @ 3:25 pm
I would tell your friend that she was clearly abused, not disciplined. There is a HUGE difference. A spank should never be given in anger or frustration. In my opinion, yelling, getting frustrated, and then just walking away will teach a child a much worse lesson than **a** slap on the hand, or **a** slap on the butt given with a calm attitude. I would never “spank” my daughter anywhere else, and never more than once. I would reiterate what I said at the beginning, there is a huge difference between abuse and discipline.
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